Glass Reflection Settings

  • Given that windows only reflect sky, as a trade off against performance, can anyone recommend the optimum reflective settings, so that


    a) you don't notice the lack of reflections so much.

    b) you don't quite see into a shop or house to notice theres no interior modelling.


    New to enscape, so hoping those who've been here a while will have found some good middle ground.


    thanks nick

  • Given that windows only reflect sky, as a trade off against performance, can anyone recommend the optimum reflective settings, so that

    That's actually only true for the lowest quality setting "Draft". Have you tried raising the rendering quality?

    a) you don't notice the lack of reflections so much.

    b) you don't quite see into a shop or house to notice theres no interior modelling.

    You could raise the roughness of the material and/or apply a dark tint color - however both won't look like glass you'd have on regular windows.

  • Hi Clemens, are you saying that Enscape now supports full reflections?


    many thanks


    nick

  • Enscape always supported reflections, since version 2.0 they're also ray traced, meaning reflections are perspectively correct. There might not be all scene geometry visible in the reflections due to real-time constraints but that's seldom a huge issue. Can you show us a screenshot of your issue? That could allow us to help you better.

  • I use one of three methods:

    - a dark-grey (almost black) colour for the glass in the house windows (<- most common)

    - a flat surface behind the window (eg 300mm from the outside wall face) with a flat non-reflective colour (not ideal since you can't tag a texture to not receive shadows - I use this for interior glass doors or windows without bars in them.)

    - colour all the interior walls/floor/ceiling with a mid grey

  • Ya...I've noticed recently that what's being reflected is not the full model. For example...just the slabs, not the whole exterior skin. How is that determined?

    It's determined based on an estimate of the geometry's impact on the lighting calculation vs rendering cost. This means nearby and large-scale, less complex geometry is preferred over complex (high-poly) small geometry that is further away.

  • Clemens,


    We have recently noticed that reflections are being compromised for the sake of performance from what I'm hearing.


    I think it is unacceptable to not have full reflections at least in the export phase of the project when its not being used in real-time.


    The trees we have in our models are only showing the branches and trunks but not any of the leaves or very few even if they are simply png files in the tree component. This seems like it would be a very small hit on performance with this type of tree.


    Please update us on the reflection agenda and if and when you plan to correct these mistakes in a future release.

  • Hi halshute


    sorry to hear you feel that way. For most Arch Viz scenarios the sometimes missing reflection detail isn't such a deal breaker compared to the much improved rendering times (also for exported screenshots & videos) in comparison to your traditional offline renderer. The offline renderer will give you of course always correct results, but you'll also have to wait much much longer.


    We can't give you an exact time line when reflections will include all scene geometry in full detail. Improvements in this regard will be incremental. For every future release of Enscape we'll try to squeeze out a little more quality, as we've proven in the past.

  • Hi Clemens Musterle ,


    couldn't we not get an extra quality slider for still images, where a lot of speed optimizations are turned off and the image quality nearly match the offline render quality? For example if an Enscape render needs 5s and an offline render needs 5min, than there is enough space for quality improvements. For me, often I decide not to use Enscape, because missing kind of materials and effects like full mirrors. There is no problem for real time HMD use, only for still images and animations. Still images and animations don't need to be ultra fast and quality limited. There is a great Enscape potential not used.


    Also missing to render simple object animations like per Rhino animation tool Bongo is a problem. I wished, the command to take a screenshot would accept an automatic enter like

    Code
    1. _EnscapeTakeScreenshotCommand _enter

    I suppose so easy to implement and it would be a big step forward for your users. Let it be a hidden test command like known from the Rhino developers.

  • couldn't we not get an extra quality slider for still images, where a lot of speed optimizations are turned off and the image quality nearly match the offline render quality?

    Unfortunately that's not as easy as that. ;)

    Also missing to render simple object animations like per Rhino animation tool Bongo is a problem. I wished, the command to take a screenshot would accept an automatic enter like

    Please stay on topic in this thread. We've noted that feature request.

  • Perhaps there needs to be several setting options for reflections.


    1. minimal

    2. cameral location creates a temporary spherical image that is the basis for the reflection map applied to reflective objects the same way the skymap is used.

    3. full reflection with distance slider and or a detail slider


    I saw you say this before that reflections are raytraced, I thought these game engine renders didn't use raytrace but some other tech that simulates it.

  • For most Arch Viz scenarios the sometimes missing reflection detail isn't such a deal breaker

    Not sure what Arch vis scenarios you're referring to. I've been in the industry for 20 plus years and it matters. Unreal gives you the ability to have proper reflections. Lumion does too. They way they do it is kind of wacky but they offer it.

  • What relationship does Enscape have to Inreal Technologies and to Crytek?

    Enscape is a spinoff company from Inreal but now independant. There is no relationship between Enscape & Crytek and has never been.


    Not sure what Arch vis scenarios you're referring to

    Of course reflections are important but hard to distinguish from somehow incorrect reflections in many cases. Take your mentions as an example. They both allow pixel-perfect reflections only on manually predefined planar surfaces, else they fall back to screen space raymarches together with cubemaps, which is perspectively almost always noticeably incorrect. We raytrace all of our reflections and indirect lighting, just sometimes textures and some content is missing in the reflections. But we're continuously improving on that end.

  • 'We raytrace all of our reflections and indirect lighting, just sometimes textures and some content is missing in the reflections. But we're continuously improving on that end.'


    Path Traced or Ray Traced Shadows and lighting?

  • They both allow pixel-perfect reflections only on manually predefined planar surfaces

    Most there are only one or a few mirrors in a room only and working with predefined surfaces sounds not bad. Would it be like in this example of the Blender screen space renderer Eevee?